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Viv
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Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Posts: 1
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:18 pm    Post subject: Votes Reply with quote

Dear All,

Can anyone tell me how the voting works?

Thanks,
Viv
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Gleb
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Joined: 02 Nov 2005
Posts: 271

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 1:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Votes Reply with quote

Viv wrote:
Dear All,

Can anyone tell me how the voting works?

Thanks,
Viv


Here the copy of an e-mail we have sent to photographers we wanted to see in our Jury (from the copy you could understand how everything works):

=======================================
Hello ......,

My name is Gleb. I send you this e-mail because you took a part in my project at photokonkurs.com. I like your works and want to ask you to be a part of jury of our site.

How it works?
If you say "YES" we put your name on the page of jury members (will make it in the end of December). You will get a special code (nobody knows the code is your code). It means everyone will know who take a part in our jury, but nobody will know who is who and how he has voted. It is important to prevent "a revenge" from other jury members and photographers if you gave a "bad" vote to somebody Surprised)
After the competition "11/12/05 - 31/12/05" we'll send you a reminder about the competition is over. You will choose 5 best pictures in 3 "prize" themes ( we have 3 prize themes and 6 prizes (3 for visitor's voting and 3 for jury voting - it means somebody could win 2 prizes together). So you choose 5 best photo from EACH prize theme (it will be 15 photos together) and give them you vote - you could put your vote as 8.7, 9.5, 9.7... it means you could vote using 1/10's of voting unit. Of course if you choose best 5 photos the votes will be not less 8. Right? After you gave your vote to 5x3 photos you send me a list of the photos you have choose and the votes for each photo. That's all.
If you take a part of the competition ALSO as PHOTOGRAPHER and you think your work enter in 5 best photos you could put to the work a vote not more than "9". It is neutral vote... (if you don't vote for your photo and photo is very high quality it will be easy to associate your code with your name. So we have decided all jury members will vote for their photo if they think it is good - anyway if we'll have 50-100 jury members this voting will be 1-2% of whole voting).
The same do other jury members. After we get the votings from you we put all votings on the page of voting near your code. It means you could see we didn't do a mistake and your votings have placed exactly as you gave it . You also could see the votings of other jury members. It means each member of jury see his own votings and the same other members do, so WE, as owners of the site, CAN'T cheat Surprised)
After that we put all votings together and see which photo gets the best rating. That's all. The winner gets a prize.
We try to do all to make a voting on our site better and more fair. We don't send such e-mail to ALL members of our competition. Only to people like you because we like your works. For us doesn't matter which place your works get in competition - good work is good work Surprised) Anyway I hope we'll find 50-100 photographers who will agree to help us in our jury and the voting will be more fair.

Best Regards

Gleb

photokonkurs.com
=================================

The first jury voting showed it was a good idea. After we have counted the results (from 60 Jury members) we have sent to Jury members this e-mail:

===================================
Hello ................,

Thank you very much for taking part in the jury of Photokonkurs.com Surprised)

We have counted the results of 12 of December 2005 - 02 of January 2006 competiton.

Here the votes of ALL jury members: http://www.photokonkurs.com/results1.txt (here your secret code: kgjuty745f - near the code we have placed your votes). Using the code you can check we put your votes the honest way, we changed nothing in your votes, etc.
Here the excel file with counted results of jury members' votes: http://www.photokonkurs.com/juryvotes1.xls
Here the first 10 winners in each 3 themes : http://www.photokonkurs.com/winnersjury.htm

The themes of the next competition are Portrait, Animals, Children, Still-Life. We have a lot of new photographers and works adding daily so it will be a lot of work to check. We don't want to take a lot of your time for this so we ask you to choose 2 themes from 4 we have. Please let me know which themes you have choosed to vote for. If you can vote for 3 or all 4 themes I will be happy Surprised) The competition running right now - from 02 of January to 22 of January of 2006.

After 23-24 of January the works will be moved to the archive: http://www.photokonkurs.com/archliste.htm

Best Regards

Gleb
=====================================


As you can see, we do all our best to run our competition a honest way as possible.

We have 60 Jury members already have voted. You can check the results by yourself ;o)

Best Regards

Gleb
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Gleb
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Joined: 02 Nov 2005
Posts: 271

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 1:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Votes Reply with quote

Gleb wrote:
Viv wrote:
Dear All,

Can anyone tell me how the voting works?

Thanks,
Viv


Here the copy of an e-mail we have sent to photographers we wanted to see in our Jury (from the copy you could understand how everything works):

=======================================
Hello ......,

My name is Gleb. I send you this e-mail because you took a part in my project at photokonkurs.com. I like your works and want to ask you to be a part of jury of our site.

How it works?
If you say "YES" we put your name on the page of jury members (will make it in the end of December). You will get a special code (nobody knows the code is your code). It means everyone will know who take a part in our jury, but nobody will know who is who and how he has voted. It is important to prevent "a revenge" from other jury members and photographers if you gave a "bad" vote to somebody Surprised)
After the competition "11/12/05 - 31/12/05" we'll send you a reminder about the competition is over. You will choose 5 best pictures in 3 "prize" themes ( we have 3 prize themes and 6 prizes (3 for visitor's voting and 3 for jury voting - it means somebody could win 2 prizes together). So you choose 5 best photo from EACH prize theme (it will be 15 photos together) and give them you vote - you could put your vote as 8.7, 9.5, 9.7... it means you could vote using 1/10's of voting unit. Of course if you choose best 5 photos the votes will be not less 8. Right? After you gave your vote to 5x3 photos you send me a list of the photos you have choose and the votes for each photo. That's all.
If you take a part of the competition ALSO as PHOTOGRAPHER and you think your work enter in 5 best photos you could put to the work a vote not more than "9". It is neutral vote... (if you don't vote for your photo and photo is very high quality it will be easy to associate your code with your name. So we have decided all jury members will vote for their photo if they think it is good - anyway if we'll have 50-100 jury members this voting will be 1-2% of whole voting).
The same do other jury members. After we get the votings from you we put all votings on the page of voting near your code. It means you could see we didn't do a mistake and your votings have placed exactly as you gave it . You also could see the votings of other jury members. It means each member of jury see his own votings and the same other members do, so WE, as owners of the site, CAN'T cheat Surprised)
After that we put all votings together and see which photo gets the best rating. That's all. The winner gets a prize.
We try to do all to make a voting on our site better and more fair. We don't send such e-mail to ALL members of our competition. Only to people like you because we like your works. For us doesn't matter which place your works get in competition - good work is good work Surprised) Anyway I hope we'll find 50-100 photographers who will agree to help us in our jury and the voting will be more fair.

Best Regards

Gleb

photokonkurs.com
=================================

The first jury voting showed it was a good idea. After we have counted the results (from 60 Jury members) we have sent to Jury members this e-mail:

===================================
Hello ................,

Thank you very much for taking part in the jury of Photokonkurs.com Surprised)

We have counted the results of 12 of December 2005 - 02 of January 2006 competiton.

Here the votes of ALL jury members: http://www.photokonkurs.com/results1.txt (here your secret code: kgjuty745f - near the code we have placed your votes). Using the code you can check we put your votes the honest way, we changed nothing in your votes, etc.
Here the excel file with counted results of jury members' votes: http://www.photokonkurs.com/juryvotes1.xls
Here the first 10 winners in each 3 themes : http://www.photokonkurs.com/winnersjury.htm

The themes of the next competition are Portrait, Animals, Children, Still-Life. We have a lot of new photographers and works adding daily so it will be a lot of work to check. We don't want to take a lot of your time for this so we ask you to choose 2 themes from 4 we have. Please let me know which themes you have choosed to vote for. If you can vote for 3 or all 4 themes I will be happy Surprised) The competition running right now - from 02 of January to 22 of January of 2006.

After 23-24 of January the works will be moved to the archive: http://www.photokonkurs.com/archliste.htm

Best Regards

Gleb
=====================================

=====================================

Viv,

As you can see, we do all our best to run our competition a honest way as possible.

We have 60 Jury members already have voted. You can check the results by yourself ;o)

Best Regards

Gleb
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hotshot
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Joined: 14 Nov 2005
Posts: 20
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 3:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Gleb, as a jury member I do find this system works very well, and especially with the large number of jurors the votes will average out nicely to the top ten or five.
My only consideration is that often I like to make a comment and I have to log in and than come back to the competition "through the backdoor" as it were. I Think another member commented on this too. To get more feedback on the photos it may be easier to change the linking after logging in - or change the log in link procedure?
Cheers
Robert
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Gleb
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Joined: 02 Nov 2005
Posts: 271

PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hotshot wrote:
Hi Gleb, as a jury member I do find this system works very well, and especially with the large number of jurors the votes will average out nicely to the top ten or five.
My only consideration is that often I like to make a comment and I have to log in and than come back to the competition "through the backdoor" as it were. I Think another member commented on this too. To get more feedback on the photos it may be easier to change the linking after logging in - or change the log in link procedure?
Cheers
Robert


Hi Robert, We have been working hard Surprised) We don't want to make the votes for the visitors after they logging on - what about somebody will make 20 e-mails, 20 accounts, logging on and vote for his work 20 votes "10"? To prevent it we have built our Jury system. One thing is important for me today is HONEST VOTE - of course with our Jury members (near 20% of them are not professional photographers, etc.) we will not get 100% professional Jury results BUT we'll get 100% HONEST voting. It is very important for me, that's all Surprised) Anyway you can't get 100% professional result even you have 100% professionals in your jury, you know Surprised)
I know every jury member almost personally - I have seen their works, I have sent PERSONAL e-mail to each jury member we have in our Jury. I answer ALL their questions personally (you know it Surprised)
The next week I plan to give google PPC adwords programm to invite more american, English, French, German, Italian photographers to participate. I have no a lot of money for it but I think we'll get 5000-6000 'english" photographers a month with this advertising, it means we'll get more jury members, visitors, etc. It is important for me because I want more money for prizes (more visitors = more money from advertising) Surprised)
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hotshot
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Joined: 14 Nov 2005
Posts: 20
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Gleb, that all sounds very well thought out and very honest! Smile
May I ask what the actual goals of the website are, who is behind it, photographer/artists? and is it self funding or is it making money for a business or sponsor? In this "cyberworld" it is often hard to see who you are working with in reality.
Meanwhile I have seen many fantastic images, it is good to get such a glimpse in what is created on your big continent. Hope your efforts are rewarded to atract more participation and sponsorship. Smile
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Gleb
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Joined: 02 Nov 2005
Posts: 271

PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hotshot wrote:
Hi Gleb, that all sounds very well thought out and very honest! Smile
May I ask what the actual goals of the website are, who is behind it, photographer/artists? and is it self funding or is it making money for a business or sponsor? In this "cyberworld" it is often hard to see who you are working with in reality.
Meanwhile I have seen many fantastic images, it is good to get such a glimpse in what is created on your big continent. Hope your efforts are rewarded to atract more participation and sponsorship. Smile


My friend Oleg, my wife and I myself are staying behind of it.
The main idea - to use the money we get from sponsors not for new car or Cartier ring but for people who send photos, that's all.
More visitors = more money from advertising = more money for prizes = more visitors = much more money, etc., etc., ...
Today we pay $900 from our pockets + our work + payment for the host + payment for advertising of the site. But today we earn near $200-$300 a month and we used 10% of our advertising space only.
We are not millioners but we see the project is very close to our dream came truth and we do all our best. Of course in the future we'll have some money from the project but I don't think it will be in 2006 or even in 2007...
The project is our child Surprised) I feeling happy when I see 80-90 new members adding every day and 400-500 new photos daily. Of course we have a lot of problem (script, cheaters, and especially TIME for the work) but I hope we'll find the solution for all problems with the help of the friend like you Surprised) The main thing is we have find the honest voting system and a lot of people trust us.
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hotshot
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Joined: 14 Nov 2005
Posts: 20
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Gleb, I wish you all my best wishes and your "sponsorship" is truly appreciated, hope that all the readers of this discussion thread will introduce new members etc. and the site will be self funding soon.
I believe such a personal profile like this will promote your site even more and stop cheaters.
For me it means a more personal approach and a way to promote photography, thanks for the opportunity your team gives the photographic community. Very Happy
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